How Much Is My State Gas Tax?

"MojoMotors.com" (MojoMotors) 09/22/2014 at 09:43 • Filed to: None

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The smartest college students in Boston know that on the way back from a ski trip, you've got to stop at the liquor store to pick up supplies before you cross the border back into Massachusetts. That's because New Hampshire has no alcohol tax, whereas Massachusetts takes $4.05 per gallon in taxes from the sale of the standard volume spirits with 40% alcohol

It turns out that the same discrepancies exist for fuel taxes. In addition to the federal tax of 18.4 cents per gallon (CPG) for gasoline, each state issues unique taxes and fees which are compounded with the federal rate.

These additional costs vary significantly across state lines. On the low end, Alaska collects 12.4 CPG for gasoline on top of the federal tax. On the high end, New York collects 50.5 CPG.

In this study, we've taken the federal tax out of the equation in order to analyze patterns and differences in state fuel taxes. Like so many "cost of living" heat maps, the discrepancy between the coasts and the interior of the US is striking. The four most expensive states to live in, according to CNBC, are New York, California, Connecticut and Hawaii. These are also the four states with the highest taxes on gasoline. Fun fact: the fifth most expensive state to live in, Alaska, has the cheapest gasoline taxes. Drill baby, drill!

It's worth noting that gas taxes can vary within states. In Oregon, for example, gas taxes vary by as much as five CPG across counties. In some states, gas is taxed differently depending on use. In North Dakota, an additional excise tax of two percent is imposed on gasoline sold for use in anything other than a licensed vehicle. This addition is waived, however, if the gasoline is to be used for heating. Good thing, because I hear it gets pretty cold up in North Dakota. That's why Paul Bunyan was always wearing those thick flannels.

Diesel is also taxed at a varying degree across the country. The federal tax rate for diesel is 24.4 CPG, six CPG more than gasoline. No surprise there since diesel is more expensive at the pumps and that's where the consistency ends. In some states, diesel is taxed more than gasoline, in some it is taxed less, and in some it is taxed the same. For all but six states, the difference is within five CPG unless you live in Pennsylvania where diesel is taxed at 10.3 CPG more than gasoline, you might want to avoid getting that turbo diesel.

Like gas taxes, state diesel taxes have their own intricacies. In Arizona, diesel is taxed at 19 CPG for light vehicles, the same rate as gasoline. For trucks with more than two axles or a gross weight over 26,000 pounds, diesel is taxed at 27.0 CPG. In Illinois, diesel blends of more than 10% biodiesel are exempt from state and local sales taxes, though this exemption is set to expire at the end of 2018.

Given these intricacies, what can we expect from gas taxes in the future? In the past, gas taxes have been levied as a source of revenue. Oregon was the first to tap into this stream by enacting a gas tax in 1919. Less than a decade later, the remaining 47 states took similar measures.

Over the years, many have thought of fuel taxes as a "user fee" that frequent motorists are charged in order to offset transportation infrastructure construction and maintenance costs. More recently, the environmental implications of fuel taxation has come to light. California, which already has the second highest gas tax at 49.78 CPG, is imposing an additional gas tax in January 2015 as a provision of a climate change bill passed by Former Governator, Arnold Schwarzenegger.

The California Air Resources Board predicts that the tax will raise gasoline prices anywhere from 20 cents to $1.30 per gallon. At the high end of that range, there would be significant pressure for motorists to limit fuel consumption either by using public transportation or by switching to more fuel efficient vehicles.

Drivers outside of the United States have long been forced to make such concessions. In Europe, for example, where gas prices can reach $10.00 a gallon, the vast majority of cars are manual transmission and pretty tiny compared to the average American car. In the US it is hard to find small cars in suburbia or a stick shift outside of a Mazda Miata. In 2011, 63% of Miata soft-tops and 49% of hard-tops sold were manual. Overall, only 6.5% of vehicles in the US are currently sold with manual transmission.

So other than saving the environment, an increase in US gas taxes could result in a resurgence of the stick shift which have historically achieved better gas mileage than their automatic counterpart. This could be a critical step in delaying the onset of the !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! because it would remind the general population of the joys of driving. More likely, is increased gas taxes would accelerate the adoption of alternate energy sources like electric and hydrogen power. With financial and environmental pressures mounting, these alternatives become more feasible and more needed every day.

Still, we have yet to see an affordable electric vehicle that offers a total range over 100 miles. More efficient hybrid and internal combustion engines are a good intermediary, but in many cases !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

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Original story here

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Mojo Motors is a website where shoppers Follow cars to get alerts when dealers drop prices.

Jacques L' Autre > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 09:52

5

New Jersey is one of the most expensive states to live in, but has the second lowest gas tax in the country... and they pump it for you. It's a bit of an exception to the notion that living on the coast automatically locks you into expensive fuel trips.

yamahog > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 09:54

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If only Michigan could actually put some of that to repairing roads and infrastructure before they're inches from disaster...

Also, with how well modern automatics have been advancing in the efficiency department, I don't think higher gas prices will necessarily warrant a manual renaissance. Anyone driving a small econobox probably gets good enough mileage not to consider learning how to drive a manual, and anyone with a big guzzly truck or SUV might consider a smaller, more efficient car without caring whether it's automatic or not.

GTI Sprinks > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 09:54

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Point to add: In Virginia, diesel is taxed differently than gasoline as you mentioned. However, for qualifying vehicles (i.e. passenger vehicles) the difference in price from diesel and gasoline can be refunded by the state through the DMV, provided the driver provides receipts from fuel stations within Virginia.

Source: http://www.dmv.state.va.us/commercial/tax…

MojoMotors.com > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 09:56

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True. There was an internal debate whether that argument should have been made in the article.

duurtlang > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:01

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Just as a small addition, where I live (the Netherlands) taxes on gasoline are roughly $5 a gallon (US). So, including tax, you're looking at roughly $8.00-8.50 a gallon (US)

yamahog > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:02

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Yall know your crowd here though ;)

MojoMotors.com > duurtlang 09/22/2014 at 10:03

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Oy. Well, at least your country is cool about "organic" pain relievers.

Samuel Jackson > Jacques L' Autre 09/22/2014 at 10:04

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That's a good point. The discrepancy between NJ and NY is very surprising to me. Anybody know why that might be?

MojoMotors.com > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 10:04

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Damn str8.

Samuel Jackson > duurtlang 09/22/2014 at 10:05

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How does that effect the way you use your car? Do you limit your driving or take public transportation for long trips when you are traveling alone?

duurtlang > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 10:14

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I've bought a car (Peugeot 406 coupe, midsize coupe) with a LPG gas conversion, which cuts my fuel bill in half. With this car driving is still cheaper than public transportation, as long as you take car ownership as a given and ignore things like depreciation.

One large difference is infrastructure. If I go somewhere within my city of 200k people I use my bicycle. Not due to financial reasons but because it's usually just as fast and there are no parking issues. However, when my car is in the shop I don't hesitate to use public transportation. You can use it to get anywhere, it just takes longer. Having said that, if I had lived in the more densely populated area of the Netherlands (' Randstad ', 7 million people) public transportation would in many instances be superior to using a car.

Kate's Dirty Sister > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:19

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Could be worse...

Titan-E34 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:19

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YEAH!!! Talk shit about Jersey now!!
*fist pumping*

Fragile_this_side_up > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 10:19

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And now a days with the CVT's, they actually edge out the manuals for fuel efficiency anyways.

MojoMotors.com > Kate's Dirty Sister 09/22/2014 at 10:20

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That provincial fuel tax will get ya.

bbutle01 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:20

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Very similar to this map. There are some noteable differences though, Ohio, Indiana, FL...

Jacques L' Autre > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 10:21

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There are a number of refining facilities inside the state, and I think the legislature has always dragged their feet when it comes to the gas tax. There's also the matter that the taxes are a lot higher in other areas that they can get away with it being that low.

bhamss1 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:21

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so bizarre. thankfully i live close enough to NJ and DE where I can get my diesel there but its just a joke.

Andrew Pickle > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:22

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I live in Kansas and work in Missouri in downtown Kansas City. I always fill up on the MO side since it's usually 10-15 cents a gallon less.

vwtypeiii > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:22

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Montana and South Dakota are the wrong color, they should be the darker blue.

Samuel Jackson > duurtlang 09/22/2014 at 10:22

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Sadly that LPG conversion does not yet exist in the US.

yamahog > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 10:22

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So New Yorkers have a reason to stop in Jersey.

/goodnatureddigs

Source: grew up in NY, we'd always fill up the RV in NJ.

Mash_Tun > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:23

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I'd happily pay more in MO, if they'd use it to PLOW THE GODDAM ROADS WHEN IT SNOWS.

solracer > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:24

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IMHO in many cases the gas tax needs to be higher, there are just too many sub-standard roads and bridges out there. In the past a lot of those costs would be paid fir by raising the federal gas tax but the current Congress isn't going to do that so the states need to make up for it.

Kate's Dirty Sister > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:24

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Montreal and Vancouver are both pretty close to the 50% tax ratio, wonder who will get there first.

Admiral Asskicker > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 10:24

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All the gas ships into Jersey ports I think.

cstealth > duurtlang 09/22/2014 at 10:25

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Not to mention how much more expensive cars are around the World rather than in the US.

Coan Arcanius > Kate's Dirty Sister 09/22/2014 at 10:26

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Was gonna chime in with the near 60 cents/gallon we have in Ontario (which isn't by far the countries worse) but I've been beaten.

Hoxtonator > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:26

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"an increase in US gas taxes could result in a resurgence of the stick shift which have historically achieved better gas mileage than their automatic counterpart. This could be a critical step in delaying the onset of the driverless car because it would remind the general population of the joys of driving"

pure day dreaming nonsense

MojoMotors.com > Hoxtonator 09/22/2014 at 10:27

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Someone's gotta keep dreaming...

yamahog > Fragile_this_side_up 09/22/2014 at 10:27

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Yup. I learned a lot of my car knowledge from my dad, who is a pretty good mechanic but with slightly out-of-date ideas, so I got burned once asserting that manuals are more efficient when my non-car-guy programmer boyfriend had a hard time believing anything human-controlled could be more efficient than a computer. Fact-checked myself, and hey, the old trope's not the case any more, but then again I've never owned a car less than 10 years old before either, lol.

SpeedKCH > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:28

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And that's why I hate living in Conn-tax-icut.

keviiinn! > bbutle01 09/22/2014 at 10:28

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New Jersey

T off the New > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:29

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Just another reason I plan on leaving NY asap.

Soon...

bbutle01 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:30

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Wow, in North Dakota you have to pay a tax to do this!

I wonder how they manage it... At the pump you have to chose between

A. I'm putting this in my car
B. I'm putting this in a gas can to take home and do this:

counterblow > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:31

2

Missouri has some of the lowest tax, some of the cheapest gas, yet they have some of the best roads. Oklahoma has same tax rate and some of the worst roads. Proof that it is HOW you spend the tax money, not how much OF IT.

Paullubbock > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:31

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There is also regional gas price variances inside of a state. In Texas where gas is relatively low compared to other states, where I live in the NW Panhandle, gas is even cheaper than Central or East Texas usually by a good 10cents a gallon.

MitchApaLoOza88 > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 10:32

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I assume the absurd toll prices in Jersey help offset the taxes. so everyone driving through the state is paying for it

Hooperdink > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:33

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Remember when you buy your liquor in NH, you can stop in the convenient "State Safety Rest Areas" on I-93 and I-95 to buy your booze. You don't even have to get off the interstate! They're also upgrading the rest area on I-93 to have (pretty cheap IMHO) gas and diesel as well as food. Oh and of course a bigger state liquor store!

(For those not in the know, the state of NH sells all hard liquor in state liquor stores. You can also buy wine there. Wine and beer are also available in convenient stores and supermarkets.)

You had fordboy357 at "meat tornado" > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:34

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So glad I live a mile from the SC state line.

Truth-Hertz > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:35

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The automatics get better gas mileage in most of the new cars car that I have seen ....

Racescort666 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:37

2

MojoMotors.com > Truth-Hertz 09/22/2014 at 10:37

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You're right, those automatic shifts are so darn efficient. That's why we made sure to add the word historically.

Toufiq > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:38

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And yet Michigan roads have potholes bigger than Kim K's butt.

ED9man2 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:40

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As much as I like the idea of manual transmission popularity increasing due to fuel savings, modern automatics match or exceed the efficiency of manual transmissions.

m2m, apex detective > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:40

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Uh ... I really think you guys do not have it that bad. At least you can still calculate using CPG, as in per g allon .

You see, the equivalent value (mineral oil tax rulings) for Germany lies – behold! – at roughly US $3.19 per gallon of unleaded fuel. Tax only. Keep in mind that the "normal" gasoline here is ROZ95. Also, I had to make do with 2007 numbers re:taxation.

The same ruling regarding different fuel types, as regulated by German EnergieStG, lets you get away with US $2.29 per gallon of Diesel. Tax.

One litre of gasoline: €0.6545 tax (sold at €1.52,9 per litre when I drove home)
One litre of Diesel: €0.4704 tax (at a rate of €1.32,9 per litre as of now)

Still feeling bad ? B - /

Samuel Jackson > MitchApaLoOza88 09/22/2014 at 10:41

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Yeah but NY has high tolls as well, especially entering NYC. Drivers coming from NJ pay a toll of $11.00 for EZ Pass and $13.00 for cash during peak hours. That shit is cray.

Vincent Davidson > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 10:43

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When I drive my '14 Accord with CVT on consistent highway trips, I average 38-41mpg. Even better than the neo Accent I had before it.

'Econobox' in non hybrid cars is a null point today when it comes to mpg.

Pretty much anything that has a 4-pot built after 2010 gets at least 35mpg.

benji > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:44

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I love how the Miata was worked into this article.

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:46

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After driving a lot in New England you can feel the diffrence when you hit the CT/Mass/RI borders. Mass roads suck.

MojoMotors.com > benji 09/22/2014 at 10:47

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Someone's gotta do it.

Sweet Trav > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 10:47

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I would have "lawyered" him. Manuals have less drive train loss. Yes I know torque converters lock up, but not under full throttle. Therefore under full throttle, Manuals = More fuel efficient.

The Gray Adder > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:48

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The part of New York State where it is most expensive to live in also the part with the most widely available public transportation network. The rest of the state is totally different; it's still possible in a lot of places Upstate to buy a big house in a nice-ish neighborhood for <$200K, but you have to drive everywhere.

Kumicho > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 10:49

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They also gear automatics pathetically tall, leading to higher MPG figures for the automatic... So the FRS in automatic gets 28mpg combined and 34mpg highway, the manual version only gets 25mpg combined and 30mpg on the highway.

I wish that they'd just gear 5th and 6th ridiculously tall on ALL cars to increase the highway cruising mpg, and leave 1-4 as they are. I don't mind having to downshift to pass someone, and I'll take that any day over buzzing along at 3700 RPM on the highway...

yamahog > Sweet Trav 09/22/2014 at 10:51

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Would've been lost on that guy. Very smart and very nice and enjoys listening to audiobooks in his automatic 328xi (it has sport mode!), but kinda dazed off when I was trying to describe the difference between AWD and 4WD.

Sweet Trav > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 10:54

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Why is it so hard to find someone to discuss the intricacies and nuances of Haldex AWD systems with?

#carnerdproblems.

special_k_side > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 10:54

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Question, is there a Federal Tax on fuel in the states?

MojoMotors.com > special_k_side 09/22/2014 at 10:56

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Yep. 8.4 CPG on gasoline and 24.4 CPG on diesel.

k4wht::lead singer, driver of the Winnebago > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 11:02

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You also have to consider individual gear ratios in two transmission types, or range of effective ratios in a CVT, combined with the differential to see what the effective final drive is. There are many known instances where there is a different final drive for manual vs automatic. Old logic is that 4th in a 4speed auto and 5th in a 5-speed are overdrive and 1 down from there is 1:1, where a CVT can vary that ratio beyond what an overdrive is in a conventional transmission. CVT's and Auto still have more driveline loss than a manual in most cases. I drive manual because I prefer the control and repair cost difference, not for any difference in fuel economy.

NYankee1927 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:02

1

Here in CA I'd be less against this if this tax was used to efficiently improve our infrastructure/road quality. So far though we are only notorious for letting everything get to the point of dangerous/breaking or spending billions on a rail system that will only have the tax payers ponying up billions for the bonds. If this system were run like a private corporation who did not have unlimited capital these project would be completed in less time and without having to pass additional costs on superfluous costs onto the taxpayers.

On a side note, I'v been lurking around and not posting for a few years, how do I get out of the grey?

Goofnik > Fragile_this_side_up 09/22/2014 at 11:02

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This goes for the 8-and-9 speed conventional automatics, and dual-clutch transmissions. The only time a manual wins over an auto in fuel economy nowadays is when the automatic is an archaic 4-speed transmission.

MrEvil > duurtlang 09/22/2014 at 11:03

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LP Gas in the US has gone through the roof. My dad purchased 150 gallons and it was almost $4/gallon. Factoring in the fact it has 0 road taxes on it it is significantly more expensive than gasoline or Diesel fuel here. There's more efforts to make LNG or CNG more common in the US due to the price of LPG and our abundant sources of Natural gas.

Shad0wguy > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:07

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Good old NY. Not only is it super expensive to live here, but we have the highest gas tax in the country. Way to go, NY!

melikecars > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:10

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Fuck being in California, if I pay these rates, at least give me 93 octane.

JordanPBurleigh > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:13

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dataPOG > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:15

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California will be number one once our Global Warming Final Solutions Act kicks in!

Oh wait...dammit!

dogisbadob > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:24

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It won't let me add annotations to the first two images! Montana and SD are colored wrong; they should be dark blue

NoCarInBrooklyn > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 11:26

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I've always heard that NJ's low gas tax is due to a strong trucking lobby in the state capital

BigBlock440 > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:27

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Where does the 41.8 come from for PA? I thought it was in the 27 cent range.

special_k_side > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:28

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Please do not have a heart attack looking at this: (Last years data)

In other words, we are paying 51 CPL in the Greater Vancouver area of BC. :(

Love to see some stats from across the pond. :)

4 cam torino > Sweet Trav 09/22/2014 at 11:31

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But you spend so little time at WOT that it isn't really a factor in MPG. And I doubt a car even sees WOT on the EPA schedule

AndreaPBaker > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:33

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> www.jobs700.com

JordanPBurleigh > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:33

0

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> www.jobs700.com

MojoMotors.com > BigBlock440 09/22/2014 at 11:34

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Source is the American Petroleum Institute

4 cam torino > Sweet Trav 09/22/2014 at 11:36

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The Haldex system was a cool system but the newer systems with a clutch at each rear wheel provide more control and better stability than the eLSD component of the Haldex system. I question how long Borg Warner will even continue using the Haldex name at all.

From a fuel economy stand point, systems with on demand clutches that can be decoupled when conditions dictate to help with fuel economy are in most vehicles anymore.

GreenN_Gold > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 11:36

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Don't jump off that ledge just yet. Car companies are good at getting autos to post great EPA numbers (sometimes too good if you ask Ford or Hyundai), but in the real world your mileage may vary. My last two cars were both sticks and they both exceeded even their highway MPG rating in mixed driving that included rush hour. I don't think I could achieve that with an automatic.

Samuel Jackson > NoCarInBrooklyn 09/22/2014 at 11:37

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That would make sense, given the fact that so many goods enter and exit the country via NJ ports.

albo > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 11:40

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It's the legacy of Standard Oil, when it was THE oil company. Plus you have at least one toll road, and fares cover maintenance on it.

Pennsylvania recently boosted the gas tax because our roads are crap due to a wicked freeze-thaw cycle and the fact that everything the heavily populated northeast wants is shipped on trucks that use our interstates.

Our "no-new-taxes, I promise" governor finessed it by taxing the oil companies, not drivers. Not that they won't pass the tax along, of course.

Tt3Sheppard > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:40

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Gas tax works if it actually goes to the roads and not to the trains and DOT paychecks. (Massachusetts)

Tt3Sheppard > Kumicho 09/22/2014 at 11:41

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I easily get 33-35mpg with the FR-S (manual) on the highway, that's with a few WOT's as well.

Goatsausage > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 11:46

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Oil refineries are in NJ. that the primary reason why its cheaper. The states that have oil refineries are typically the cheapest, all the other states get there gas from them. NY is crazy high because of NY's corruption. NJ sells gas to NY at a premium which is bad, but NY gas taxes are crazy high as well. then theres state and local tax and some other thrown in just to make you feel bad.

yamahog > Sweet Trav 09/22/2014 at 11:48

1

Lol, that's how I feel dating someone who doesn't know football too.

GreenN_Gold > Truth-Hertz 09/22/2014 at 11:48

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In the real world or just on the window sticker?

Kumicho > Tt3Sheppard 09/22/2014 at 11:49

1

Well, yes, but I'd bet that there is anecdotal evidence of automatics getting that mileage (or better) as well. My point was that due to gearing many cars today get better mileage in automatic than in manual form. Shittier performance, but better mileage.

Lars K Tennyson > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 11:49

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Because NY sucks. I go to the Indian Reservations to fill up because it's so bad in Upstate NY

Sweet Trav > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 11:50

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who are these jokers you're dating?

LS1RX7-owen > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 11:50

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I think the manual transmission is dead as far as fuel efficiency is concerned... even in 2009 my Honda Civic got worse mpg in manual, I still bought it but I knew this was a sign of the times. The computer capability of OEMs brings the new generations of automatic transmissions into the forefront of better fuel economy and in some ways "locks it in" with less varaiation per customer compared to a manual transmission model.

LS1RX7-owen > Samuel Jackson 09/22/2014 at 11:51

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Isn't all of NJ full-service only? No self serve gas stations iirc in NJ.

yamahog > GreenN_Gold 09/22/2014 at 11:51

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Yea, we know this, but I'm thinking the type of customer who buys a brand new car to save money on gas (something that rarely comes close to being worthwhile if the old car was paid off) probably won't even think to go to an older car with a manual trans.

yamahog > Sweet Trav 09/22/2014 at 11:57

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Non-car-guy and I were nearly engaged after dating for most of college, and CrzRsn is no football fan. I find it kind of funny that dating women has yielded more success for me in the (cars+sports+tolerable) departments than dating men has, but we'll see how it goes this time around.

GV_Goat > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 12:04

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I'm probably not the first to point out that the color coding is wrong on at least two states... :)

xequar > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 12:05

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Absolutely. This makes me hate MDOT even more. Yeah, they're really good at putting up signs. I mean, Michigan's road signs are the nicest looking, well-installed, modern signs I've seen anywhere in the U.S., but damn our roads are shit! I just came back from Tennessee, and without even seeing the signs I knew I had entered Michigan by the sudden violent bouncing and shaking and feeling as though I was driving through pits and chasms. I mean, it's bad enough that MDOT is absolutely incompetent, but to be that incompetent with that much gas tax money? Sickening.

AmericanWhalingLeague > Jacques L' Autre 09/22/2014 at 12:06

1

We get a bit of a break at the pump, but that's countered by the pumping we receive while paying property taxes. Eventually, your ankles get calloused from being grabbed, so hard, so long, that mobility issues ensue and you get wheeled out. If you can't work, you can't pay property taxes. We're losing 40,000 residents per year.

GreenN_Gold > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 12:11

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I was referring to new cars, too. It's easy to exceed the EPA numbers with a stick.

Tt3Sheppard > Kumicho 09/22/2014 at 12:14

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I agree, they are doing everything they can to get those MPG's up.

yamahog > xequar 09/22/2014 at 12:18

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Well, if it was an interstate, that should at least be federally funded, but those are a mess too.

GrauGeist > MojoMotors.com 09/22/2014 at 12:24

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" an increase in US gas taxes could result in a resurgence of the stick shift which have historically achieved better gas mileage "

Oh, funny!

John Henry only beat the machine once, then he died.

The new generation of 7/8/9+speed ATX systems using DCT and CVT tech are going to do better than the average MTX driver, and that's what matters for CAFE.

Note also that the engines these will be going into are smaller and smaller. I'm pretty sure that the typical old school MTX driver didn't learn on a 1.0l 3-cylinder turbo - they learned on a high-torque V-8. If every car has the torque curve of a farm tractor, driving a MTX is pretty easy.

We'll continue to see cars get progressively smaller and smaller over the next 5-10 years, as cars get replaced. This organic shift is relatively painless.

GrauGeist > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 12:25

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I think Michigan is too busy trying to keep Detroit from going bankrupt to keep the roads straight.

Sweet Trav > yamahog 09/22/2014 at 12:25

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Surprisingly the I-96 project wasn't a complete clusterfuck. After taking the surface streets for 7 months I was extremely relieved to take the ramp heading west.

GrauGeist > Sweet Trav 09/22/2014 at 12:27

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Manuals waste gas every time they shift gears, unlike a stepless CVT. A good CVT will beat any MTX.